kate and her lemon tree [??] from 95

i understand

but i thought that it the intention behind this whole forum deal was to aloow frank and honest debate.

but channel z seemed a little vulnerable there for a while. almost as if they didn't contol the air waves.

you can't criticise them, no.

i am still apalled.

nice work stolwhatever.

impressive display indeed.

i embrace you as a friend on this great quest for truth and meaning in the musical realm.

and i'm with you on the flying nun thing. i think it's bollocks for the most part.

as for the whole commerciality issue, you seem vehement in your defence. but utterly unconvincing. we are gods of our own music tastes, not yours. that has become readily apparent.

if you wish to join the sciolists who look to more fm etc for music edification, then go right ahead. and if you wish to write music for that scene, then, again, go right ahead. but if you want to create and express yourself within the bounds of simulacra and mimickry that govern that commercial scene, don't expect to gain respect from those who respect music as something other than a commodity.

on the other hand, maybe matchbox 20 reaches you in a profound way. again and again i return to the meal metaphore in dealing with these aesthetic debates: do you want a pack of m & ms or do you want a homecooked banquet? (i see matchbox 20 as more like a bag of chips).

as for the feelers, i've never really got into this one. generally speaking, i wont attack anything unless it's thrust down my thoat without my consent. but hey, this is a forum - where myself and my esteemed colleague can air our concerns, likes dislikes and beliefs. and if that freedom manifests itself as abuse to the f@ckin feelers, then so be it.

i don't expect everyone to like slint or june of 44, mogwai, oldham, slint again, hdu, subliminals, cabellero, bitch magnet, dionogah, tortoise, sea & cake, shipping news, jakob the list goes on. but on a musical level i think those people are both very sad and very ignorant. they're missing out on a great ride.

but they can sod off when they listen to mongols extole the virtues of the new feelers single. the single is not hot (unless it's on fire) and it is not the 'best new music' and it is not worth our time. it is bilge produced by people who have made the mistake of relying on music as a means of income and fame, rather than a creative honest means of expression.

and guess what, those people can f^ck off.

yes stellar, that goes for you too.
and you too, k'lee,
and you too, - isn't it great, i can't even think of these 'artists' cause i dont listen to the radio. why have this shit in my head?

you all get the drift.

lates

ironic isn't it: once bands realise that it may be possible to make a career and devote themselves to producing great music, that's when things turn to custard.

so it seems that the only way to have a great music scene is to have part time musicians who make music not out of the desire to accumulate financial profit but out of necessity -becuase if they don't, there will be nothing left

when you think, hollis, that there are people like us, here in nz, that dig this type of stuff, you gotta wonder where all the fans of this stuff are. (and what are they doing). we should have a much better music scene than this.

very difficult to gauge just how good that band slint was cause they can totally reset ones musical trajectory. after that slint aren't just another band. (even though they are).

in fact, it's almost difficult to keep them from dominating your judgements completly

blah blah

wow, that's some list hollis

are you also into the for carnation?

yeah, it depends on your state of mind - what you feel like doing at any given time. some music demands involvement and investment from its audience. that is cool when you.re ready to rock. other time you can't be assed and just bear it. but the bottom line for me is that either i like it and i want it turned up or i dont and i want it turned off.

martha could not be more wrong if she set herself on fire and ran headlong into a petrol plant

the only radio i listen to is radio sport when test cricket is on.

take mogwai for example...

just take them

this reply stuff makes no sense

when hollis made that comment re tetris he made it to you, martha, not to me

that (this) kind of thing just muddies the water.

martha:

not sure what you mean

as i understand it, when you 'reply to post' the reply appears under the original comment, even where that comment occured some time ago. sure, it allows you to determine which post the reply relates to, but it totally disrupts any chronological continuity

but hey, this is about my 6th posting- what do i know

thank you for your concern

antic:

so you put the good/bad music issue in the 'too hard basket'

and yes, it does stop us in our tracks.

and yes, i too, believe that some music is intrinsically better than other music.

it really has to do with what we want from the music we listen to - and reconciling our differing tastes on that basis.

and yes hollis, we are not at all 7 nautical miles away from each other's sentiments.

i am just trying to recall when our discussion constituted an argument?

antic:

if all music is equal in worth (aesthetic, i suppose)

none can be said to be better than another - it is up to the individual

so, we cannot criticise radio stations cause they just play certain genres of music.

the only real way we can get to them is by what hollis was saying: that is, attack them for the way they discharge their editorial role. why do they only play aguilira? or rubicon?

the prob there is that these stations make it clear what the are trying to do.

maybe it's good that there is no radio station for me. i think that it's kind of scary that people like the same music anyway. we are not the same, so why allow our music tastes to become homogenised?