//actually, we met them all and chilled with them last year
oh dear, oh dear....... should we respect you more now?
I agree I was being a little pig-headed. Yes.
It's just I think, you believe what you believe about Djs, and no one (or me) can change that, and why try. I knew your long response would reflect that, and it would just frustrate me to read. Sounds like you hang out with them and some call themselves musicians? I dunno. I hang out with fellow, hard working, practicing, song writing, musicians.
anyway, no harm done.
You believe what you believe, and I'll know what I know.
Easy. I can be freinds with people who have deeply ingrained, different views than I.
Didn't mean to get nasty really, that's just my frustration you saw.
You make absolutley no sense, hence I can not talk to you or even take time to read your long winded responses. Sorry.
Yet I still dont forgive for patronizing me.
(You must be new-by. Hit reply to post, and not "add comment". gee, how many times do I have to say it.)
Hey nzr, nice talking to someone reasonable with intelligence and some level of respect for others. (Next you respond, hit "reply to post" instead of "add comment". Just makes the order of the conversations make more sense.)
//You're right, I would classify Scribe as hip hop, and yeah I don't like it.
Sorry, I misunderstood your appreciation of Scribe and P Money. But you don't actually like their work. Understand completely.
//all these idol shows do is put forward singers to perform a song that has already been done.
Ah, you see that's a little trick. People tend to like what they know. They've already warmed to the songs, half the job is done- Hence, people enjoy to covers bands, something they can sing along to, and covers bands do well financially. As the record companies do well with Idol.
Keep in mind, if they tried to push a series of original singles by no-bodies- they would flop. Plus, these Idol singers are most probably not song writers, and they would produce painful music, being new to the industry. The whole idea would not work unless they had a VERY open minded audience.
//Real talent, real creativity stands the test of time.
Too true! What you say about Disco is interesting, how it was a passing thing. It was a very short-lived era, directly before the rise and fall of punk. (Sex Pistols were mainstream breifly in the late 70's, as you may well know).
One disco band was the Bee Gees. When the shit hit the disco fan, they seemed to move with the times, and turned into Pop. (Please I'm not a fan, just sayin)
Shapeshifter use instruments to produce dance music. Like the band N.E.R.D. Hip hop with instruments. On to it, funky as, musicians (plus a great vocalist). That could be the next step. Maybe people will by-pass computers, and get back to the organic way of music. (?). and Dj's will maybe go back out to country pubs to play mainstream albums at request of the slappers, where original bands dare not go.
Being called darlin straight off? How patronizing.
Im not even gonna read. Ive gotta get back to work.
fin.
Hey nzraven, I noticed something.
You say
//I dislike hip hop, and rap.
and then go on to say
//New Zealand needs more original artists, like These Four Walls, like Epitome, like SCRIBE
What style of music is Scribe to you? Just wondering.
Amine.
Firstly-
//And "hip hop" is such an all-encompassing term that you are ruling out a lot of music that you might actually find yourself enjoying!
Ummmm, ok. I said yesterday. // I am a Hip Hop fan. >>> in all its forms.
I didn't say I hated any style, hip hop or other. I was just explaining different occupations within the dance/hip hop industry for you.
//"turntablism" produces original music.
No. The dj would be collaborating (unofficially normally) with 2 of more recording artists. Stepping in and changing works produced by others (composers, producers AND musicians), to make his (or her) own "mix". Original?
Again, unless they ARE the composer......
Composers, turntablist and djs are three different things remember.
Turntablists impress me when they put on a show and use their body - or PERFORM. Competitions are amazing to watch with multiple decks and they come up with some pretty crazy shit. But if we use other peoples music to derive it from- is it original? Dj's put on, and mix other peoples music. Composers write, producer, programs.
//essence of the art - THE MIX is what matters to the dj.
The mix is all he (or she), HAS...... UNLESS they are a composer (writer, musician, producer). There's a sense of pride that comes from writing and producing your own music. M.i.d.i (musical instrument digital interface) programs are often used by composers - a computer module programmed to sound like instruments or frequencies (subs-bass etc). Unless there is live samples involved. This could get complicated, I don't have to energy to explain this now.
//you can't resurrect a bunch of soul groups from the 70s to come play live one after the other on any given night and that is also where the dj comes in...
Why are we talking about 70's motown (Soul?)
I've been attending dance parties (or "Raves" as they were called) since the early to mid 90's. I grew up playing all kinds of instruments. Just saying, I am very open minded and prefer not to rule out any style of music or art form, unless its overtly offensive (some hip hop is you would agree).
//I'm in agreement with what you're saying!
Good.
//New Zealand doesn't need is anymore Idol shows.
agreed. But we can't rule out that some of these singer's are talented and they just probably wanna sing. Just like many musicians wanna get out and play. We can't attack those people. It's the record comany's making money from young females (mainly) - a very impressional market with money and txt messages to burn on CRAP. and the record companys know what they're doing, thats why we keep getting the show. It's just a shame we have to view them taking childrens pocket money.
I reckon the market in NZ is very much like the American market. Heavily saturated by hip hop and rap. No one else gets a look-in much.
Is that because NZ whats to be like America?
We should fuck them right off and get back to basics.
and on the other side of Rappers- working with them- are DJ's, who play or blend (often other people's) music on some form of disc. If they write and produce their own? or orcestrate their own music on a computer or another midi device? They would be a COMPOSER. Obviously they are not actually playing any instruments. Instead they USE turn-tables.
and last I checked, turn-tables are not classed as an instrument, hence-
- they are not musicains either.
I see hip hop as a certain type of music, not played by actual "Musicians" - (in the traditional sense) and before you hook into me, I am a hip hop fan. Stop and think.
// I can do better than most of these so called "musicians"
oooooOOOOOOOooooooo!! Someone's having a little tanty!
// someone who plays a musical instrument (as a profession) ----- Obviously.
And Singer, sings. Fuck me! who knew.
Rappers that dont sing (a different type of lyricist to a vocalist) -Rap. That's Different. It's more, a form of art or self-expression with a message. Like poetry. Or being skilled with their speaking voice, and the way and speed that person relays, or improv's their lyrics.
Auctioneers are also skilled with their speaking voice. Let's call them Musicians too!!
Nah, Hey, lets ALL be musicians!!
Fuck you guys fallen off the edge of the earth or something? No ones updating ya website, werent you guys recording an album fuckin yonks ago?
Whats goin on in camp cowboy?
// especially when all the heaters in the practice rooms have crapped out)
Heaters? bro- my band needs fans to cool us down! Are you in a folk band or something?
Dude- sounds like you should get the fuck out of there. I know what you mean about Nelson. Good to visit for Phat outdoors, but I couldn't live there again.
So would you move to Christchurch or Wellington? (if, or when, you decide to move)
// well if you are paying for all the publicicty, you should be taking the door
You're not wrong mate!
Otherwise bands are just doing the venue a favor, and at the end of the night (after pouring their hearts out, sweating away and lugging gear after that) are walking away with LESS money in their pockets as a result. If they're lucky, each member may get a free beer or two.
And that's just fucked up!
Frankly, it makes me fucking angry!!!!
// so what venue bookers arnt paying bands?
Yeah, who are they!!!????
And who's treating bands well then?????
I've found if venues treat bands well- good rider, and pay them well- the best bands in town will line up to play there- making more people come through the door, making more money on the bar for the venue which can then be used to pay the bands. And if venues DONT pay bands, they should at least do advertising for their own venue, and the bands should take 100% of the door. Publicans make SHIT LOADS on the bar on a good night, and they wouldn't have good nights on the bar if it wasn't for the bands. That's the reason pubs have bands- to make money on piss sold.
At the end of the night when the bar is doing the tills, and going hehehehehe, the bands are giving their own hard earned money from their much needed day jobs, to pay the mixer. It's expensive being a musician.
Paying to play while the venue and mixer makes all the money.
It's not fair is it!!!
// hahah getting paid, nice one.
Riiiight, so bookers are contacting bands, essentially employing performers for a night, and telling them - hey can we book you guys in for Friday week? You won't be getting paid a cent though ofcourse. Do you mind?
Sounds good!
The no smoking must have a real impact on live music all over the country too huh?
So the 'Studio' is in Wellington?
//a month or so of empty weekends followed by four or five great shows that all clash over one weekend.
Don't you think this would be the fault of Wellys band bookers? If they operate in good venues, they should be booking bands weekly, competing with other venues and therefore creating more live music.
What are the band bookers of Wellington venues doing?
Is it an issue of not wanting, or not having the $$$ to pay bands? Not enough bands? I don't understand.
10 bands??? Fuck, with a population of 163,824 people you'd think they'd be able to form more than 10 bands? Possibly you, or NZ musician magizane, meant 10 current, credible bands that are doing well?
// Studio has to be the best layout for musicians in the country
Where is 'Studio'?. And do you think that because of the size and shape of the venue? Or the size of the stage, or the P.A?
Christchurch huh? Can it be compared with Aucks and Wellys? Just going by the size of the cities. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I can't imagine it would have bigger crowds and more stuff happening.
or
[ external link ]