//Smacking isn't okay//

well you haven't been smacked, so what have u got 2 say it's not ok when used appropriately? If you've never experienced it you can't really make an 'informed' judgement heh. Now I'm not promoting excessive force of course and smacking should only be used as a last resort for the child's own protection, because there are plenty of other logical ways of exerting authority although it is quite hard to have an in-depth lecture about the pro's and con's of dangerous behaviour with a 5 yr old...

Not since you were 5? Well then you were still smacked. I havn't been smaked since i was about 5 or 6 either, cos i learned early. Kids learn in their first 7 years most of everything in their lives. Right and wrong, morals, judgement, all the emotions. How to get attention etc. You can only say "no" so many times. I do it with kids i babysit and it works. They play with something, you say no, and take them away. You do that 3 or 4 times. They do it again, you say no, and smack their hand. It just gives them a shock, but it interupts what they're doing. They soon learn that no means to stop something. They look at you as if you're a huge ogre, but they soon learn. Most people don't keep hitting their kids, and we're talking smacking here, not hitting. Taking them into another room for "time out" just promotes that when they're bad they get put in their room and either they'll link it to play time with their toys, or that the bedroom is a bad place to be, and will be murder trying to get them to sleep. You're constantly making links in your head as a kid. Either your parents are their for fun, or they're their to beat you. Out of the mouths of babes as they say...

Actually your right. This shouldn't be debatable the government should fuck off out of this and let people raise their kids as they see fit. Which includes choosing which method of discipline they use be it the "time out" crap or a swift kick in the pants. Only in cases of abuse should the government have any say in how we raise our children.

hippypissmefish, I prefer to wear my sandals as a means of protecting my feet rather than as a means of laying down my authority.

I second heather. Ever tried stopping that? I also use the "ok see ya later" line and walk out. You'll find most kids will come and at least freak out if you actually leave the store. I'd never do it down town auckland, but i'd do it in Thames. Done it before.

Try younger. Try a kid that will look at you directly in the eye while diong something they arn't mean to. Deal with little ones. Better yet, deal with more than one. You got a 2 year old and a 3 month old you're feeding. No one else around. The 2 year old is across the room and runs just out of view. You suddenly realise that you'd left some stuff in the bathroom soaking in bleach in a bucket your kid had been playing with earlier that day. You get there just in time to see her iwth her play cup about to drink some. No or stop? They don't listen. They drink it. You're at the hospital having the kids stomach pumped.

Don't tell me this doesn't happen, cos there are so many different things that happen daily - you can't control the outside world, but you can control your kids. At least partly to stop them from getting hurt.

I'm never gonig to bash my children. A swift smack around the back of the thighs hurts, but is not enough to really hurt them, just stun them.

I'm picking you don't babysit a lot for young ones.

Interesting arguement, and a good idea. But easily forgotten most of the time, especially with really young ones. Good for a bit older, but a one year old doesn't understand it much. It needs to happen immediately after the child has done something, and when they're that young, anything takes their attention. A smack imprints in their brain that if they do something it will hurt. it's immediate.

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I only smack if i'm allowed. But i'd never smack them on the bum. Generally it's just a whack on the hand if they're little and doing something wrong. But even then, if the parents don't, i don't.

Though for some i wish i could....

I'm sorry sam but your plight didn't really have a lot to do with smacking. You would have had exactly the same results with your parents if they never touched you at all. I agree with you on one point I don't plan to ever smack my kids. However I also know that my wife/partner may feel differently and I also know that the best of intentions don't always turn out how you envision. Were you the oldest in your family?

I fail to see how a couple of smacks on the hand/bum can lead to devil worship. I don't think your folks can take the rap for all the stupid shit you did. Imho that whole post is just a great big fucking cop out. Grow up.

Smacking didn't. THe mind games did. And stop blaming others for the shit you went through.

I was an asthmatic my whole childhood, and spent most of my time in hospital. I could use that and blame that for my lack of energy now, or seeing the whole world as a sick place.

We all have experiences. I have friends who have been raped, and lots worse stuff than corporal punishment. It's what you make of your life. I agree, you're just using it as a cop out. Stop defending it, and deal with it for once. Stop blaming someone, and change your own life the way you want it to be.

Yea, i think it sucks that you had that happen to you. But guess what - i watch cancer basically eat up my young gran, and now i'm watching my mother go through it too. I would take a beating of a cat'o'nine'tails every day if i could take away the fact she has incurable cancer!

I lost one of my closest friends on christmas day just gone. He died in a freak accident. He was 22! He was doing well with his life, and had SO many friends, he couldn't keep up with everyone. I could go all depressed and mourn for him every day - easily, believe you me! - but i don't, i carry on, and i try to make something of my life! Imagine what his family will have to go through for the rest of their lives without him - i wouldn't blame his parents and brother or sister if they never walked out of their house again.

There are people worse off, feel sorry for yourself, sure, but deal with the shit - go to a councilor if you have to - deal with it, and make something of your life. Stop playing the blame game, and spend that time on watching sunsets, or trying to make sure it doesn't happen to other kids.

I think i can speak for both sam and i - NO THANKS!

:o)

What your parents were doig was not disciplining you for your own benefit but rather it appears they were trying to shape you in a way that conformed to their rather twisted idea of what constitutes a 'good' person.

Three of four cracks across the arse for poor performance at school is assault and in no way reflects what a loving parent would do to encourage their offspring to do better.

// "a smack on the bottom and smacking ur kids
// around like a ragdoll are completely different!"

GrEeBo, I think that's exactly the problem the 'stupid monkies in the parliment' [sic] are trying to sort out with this new bill. As it stands, there is no difference between beating up your kid and a smack. With the new law, the 'reasonable force' defence that parent's could previously use to justify child abuse will be removed, and the police and social services will have greater powers to pursue those who do beat up their kids. No-one's going to be prosecuting parent's who smack their kid's bum in a moment of stress -- it's squarely aimed at parent's and guardian's who assault the children in their care.

ugh. grocer's apostrophe's.

'special' - pear's, apple's.

Just don't tell dust I said that..

meh. we've been through all this before.

the law *will* ban any form of physical assault, but like I say, and as the politicians promoting the law have stated, the police are not going to be hauling up every parent who smacks their kid on the bum for assault. It's more the theory behind the law than the reality of day-to-day life that is the issue: a modern society should not need to justify physical violence in its laws under any circumstances, particularly violence towards children.

Like I said on another forum, if the police were going to take everyone to court who was technically guilty of assault, you'd see every rugby and league player in the country lined up in the dock on monday morning.

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Learn to spell, dickbrain!

Do you really?