Good NZ lyricist - any recommendations?

Hi, can anyone recommend a good NZ lyricist?
Some I have admired in the past include Don McGlashan (Blam Blam, Mutton Birds) - his songs have a real sense of NZ in them.
Jeremy Taylor (Throw, Cinematic) - his songs have an angsty quality perfect for pining after love lost and found.
But I'm struggling to come up with any other intelligent NZ lyricists; i.e. a cut above your Datsuns/Tadpole/Strawpeople kinda thing.
Jon Toogood (Shihad) has his moments, in a kind of "smash-the-system" way, but he's lost the plot on the new album.
Bic Runga's new album is lovely though.

Also, can you describe the music they make too.
righto,

Forums: NZ Music,

You forgot Neil Finn!

Graeme Downes - The Verlaines - imho is a stronger lyricist than anyone you mention here. You might also try Peter kean from the Able tasmans - old skool FNuners and oh so good

I think that Victoria Girling Butcher is a good lyricist - she certainly has an interesting use of words. You can try them out by getting the Lucid3 album, Running Down the Keys.

http://www.lucid3.com ]

yes agree with your call Myshkin, I have found myself just reading the lyrics at times with out the music, there also are some very powerful lyrics put together by Trinty Roots.
Che Fu lyrics all so have a resonance.

The Brunettes... I love their lyrics! esp. Spice girls rip off "if you wanna be my lover you gotta get with my friends!" (unknown Brunettes song played on Space).

Chris Mathews from Headless Chickens.
David D'ath from the Skeptics - if you like 'em schizophrenic
Gramsci has his moments too. . .

I really like James Reid from The Feelers.. He writes cool as lyrics

http://www.highersin.cjb.net ]

eddie from deg k - musicly 70's free form love flow ism www.degreesk.com
scott mason from fuce - when you can work them out www.fuce.co.nz
andi and fud from cripple mr onion - www.cripple.co.nz

danks and me from 'orkid
the list is endless

Thanks, but I think some of you are missing the point. I'm talking about lyrics which could stand up on their own.
Also, what are the lyrics about?
James Reid and Neil Finn's lyrics are basically about nothing specific.

I found the Verlaines and Able Tasmans lyrics are both a bit hard to deduce what's going on. They're kind of unspecific; I want something with clarity.

Perhaps something like " I met her outside the IGA / true love works in funny ways / being going round / 6 months now / engagement pretty soon" Something like that? spelling mistakes - true love - early nz punk 1979-ish

I'd have to say that Carly Binding's lyrics are masterful.
"alright with you, there's nowhere i would rather be".
Good stuff!

(gasp /shock/horror)

Greg Johnson ain't too bad either. "Isabelle" is quite a sweet little song lyric-wise.

Yeah Greg Johnson..nice

"we are deja voodoo we rock more than you do".can't beat it.so few words, yet it speaks volumes.

i aggree with james, those must be the greatest lyrics ever wirtten

lol...wicked!!!

They're straight to the point

I'll echo Chris Matthews (Headless Chickens) - check out "Expecting To Fly", "Gaskrankinstation" & "Magnet" for starters.

I don't really understand yr restrictions, though; & if you want "clarity" (heh) in yr Verlaines lyrics check out the Juvenilia compilation. Early Martin Phillips (The Chills) is great as well ("Pink Frost", "I Love My Leather Jacket", "Doledrums", "Kaleidescope World" etc)

oh yeah & this question is fundamentally rockist

The question isn't meant to be "rockist". It's just that electronica doesn't generally go in for songs, or telling a story.

Like spilly's suggestion.
The point I'm trying to go for is lyrics that can make you feel something; that you can react to. Agree about the early Chills lyrics, with the exception of "Leather Jacket" - that song's all about the riff, not the words (not that it isn't great though).
Actually I once heard the Exponents butcher it in concert.

Okay, my problem with this is threefold - as somebody who has the, er, fortune to have worked both as a poet & a lyricist - lyrics aren't poetry. They're not intended to be read. You can't seperate them from the vocals (say, the way Martin Phillips' voice quavers on the "she's" in "what do I do if she's lost / just the thought turns my heart to pink frost" in "Pink Frost"); or the way vocals combine with the music - if you didn't need music for the lyrics to work, why bother with it? (I should also say something about genre conventions; use of cliché etc but this post will be long enough as it is . . .)

"lyrics that can make you feel something; that you can react" is incredibly subjective & any answer anyone gives will likely be correct; + there's all the issues of usage/context/etc inherent in the dialogue between artist and audience. Things vary wildly depending on mood, circumstance or whatever - personally, Bob Dylan does nothing to me while, say, Telepopmusik's "Breathe" has had me close to tears; or having the repitition in Underworld's "Cowgirl" approach a near-liturgical power. When I was eking out a scumtron life as a student, early Verlaines suddenly made perfect, undeniable sense (sorry, I'd dig out some examples if my CDs were on the same island as me).

Let's see - are you wanting lyrics to tell a story? In that case, I think you should be investigating hip-hop ;-)

(& "Leather Jacket" has great words - it's all about the transition/dialogue between warmth/joy & loss/memory/responsibility that happens about halfway through the first verse!)

(&& er, no offence or whatever intended by this, but I've got a vested interest. oh & "rockist" was a term coined by Melody Maker journalists in the early 80s to denote a sort of attitude that is obsessed with authenticity, worships the canon (ie only likes things if they have/will "stand the test of time", favours albums over singles, mind over body, moralism over materialism. Er, probably shouldn't have introduced it into the debate etc)

// lyrics aren't poetry

But that isn't to say they can't be right? I don't think that is absolute.

// Let's see - are you wanting lyrics to tell a story? In that case, I think you should be investigating hip-hop ;-)

Huh? Maybe this was in jest but many "rock" artist have songs that tell stories, Tenacious D, Arlo Guthrie...

(er, the following isn't meant to sound snappish or whatever, but this is likely to be bashing-my-head-repeatedly-against-a-brick-wall material)

Er, how can lyrics be "right"? Can they be "wrong"? I'll paraphrase what I said at the end of my first paragraph - if there's music (or, fuckit, a specific human voice) there, that's part and parcel of the track/artwork/whatever. Privileging lyrics & divorced them from their context makes as much sense as privileging the hi-hats or the reverb or the coverart or the promotional campaign.
& nothing's absolute, of course - but I think the whole "rock is poetry" thing was advanced in the 60s/70s as a strategy in the (word warning!) pre-postmodern (wrt/validity of pop/youth culture) climate that "rock" was "art". But, er, look at one of Dylan's songs on page and quite frankly, treated as a poem, it's not very good. How it works as a song is a completely different matter.

//but many "rock" artist have songs that tell stories//
Well, yes. Due to genre conventions (chorus, rhyme+length, notions of "singing") & limitations (instrumentation), it's not as easy/common. Hip-hop's verbal cadences & freedom & density (& perhaps lack of a strangling tradition) tend to make storytelling the default in hip-hop, as opposed to the simpler narratives & emoting of rock. Yesyesyes these are sweeping generalisations and there are millions of exceptions, but, say, what rock song sets up a narrative as well as, say, Public Enemy's "By The Time I Get To Arizona" or "Black Steel In The Hour Of Chaos"? Oh yeah & see : folk music (well, actually /you/ mentioned Guthrie etc etc etc).

im pretty sure stefan's sentence was supposed to read

"But that isn't to say they can't be, right?" totally diff, scrap your first paragraph :)

stop killing your brain cells

thanks jimi.
stupid comma.

hey, I'm stuck in Rotorua - this is giving my brain cells much needed exercise ;-)

I like Andrew Brough's lyrics, pleasantly angsty (with a jangly pop background)

i rate last exit to garageland as a smart and classic album that managed to find it's own voice
"i was a teenage drunken suicide and i wrote poetry too
now it all kind of disgusts me and 2 of them were about you
everybody could fly but you'd better not try
doesn't matter who you talk to everybody's given up
nude star
i'd desert you in a second but i don't know where you are"

naked star deserves to be an anthem esp in the current "datsuns are huge shall we start clobbering them yet" climate i say the nude stars/emperors are wearing clothes i hope they rule long and hard!

best lyricists currently are:
jeremy taylor, lindon puffin, jody lloyd, - they should team up and do an album together.

arent lindon puffin and jody lloyd doing a gig together?