Anyone got any serious suggestions?
Is it that we lack funds to buy time to produce really world-class music?
Do we care about producing world class music?
Is it because we lack the population?
Is it our attitude?
Help!
How do we get our shit out there and make them want to hear it?
Do we have to make New Zealanders want to hear it first?
Is there anything specifically NZ about our sound?
Does the world want it?
Could I ask anymore questions?????
No opinion here. Just opening it up for ideas.
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answered in order. we do have world ...
answered in order.
we do have world class music.
we obviously care, because we do it.
n/a
the only help we need is more investment in bands by record companies.
more investment in bands by record companies.
not necessarily.
definitely, even the shit music has us in it.
the world wants good music. we have it.
many more.
many more quetions could be asked, ...
many more quetions could be asked, including, why the fuck is this in the bar instead of nzmusic forum?
someone please move it
job done...and nice comments too. And ...
job done...and nice comments too. And here's a question for Ellafitz: how do you define "world class?"
thanks mate - appreciated. of all ...
thanks mate - appreciated.
of all the internationals i know - they all (and that means all) love our music. because it's a bit different? because its so goddamn good? i dunno......
Yeah Ellafitz, what is the definition ...
Yeah Ellafitz, what is the definition of "world class?"
I don't really know Lemonde. I wanted ...
I don't really know Lemonde. I wanted to serve it up for debate. Maybe "worl class" is as simple as...if I was an alien looking at music that summed up the best Earth has to offer, would I choose NZ music? Personally, yes, but I'm not quite sure whether or not that's because I'm proud of what we've achieved without all the bi budgets (i.e; patriotism to an extent) or whether it's because some of our stuff really stands up against other stuff in the world at large.
Is there anything we're doing that blows an international equivalent (genre wise) out of the water?
Educate me...(I'm not being a smart arse)
I couldn't possibly educate you Ms ...
I couldn't possibly educate you Ms Fitzgerald
You're one of the brightest girls I know.
Datsuns and Sommerset are both on ...
Datsuns and Sommerset are both on international tours at the moment, the former wowing the White Stripes; the Clean Dead C, Space Dust and others have been indie radio faves in the States for yonks, with people like Steven Malkmus attributing a resurgence in interest in jangly guitar bands to New Zealand bands; Shapeshifter and other Drum'n'Bass guys are producing a bunch of white label albums that never make it back here.
Maybe we don't care so much about the flash and glitter of the big international acts which are more about the show than the music, but we have lots of very dedicated musos here plus many devoted lovers of their outputs.
Sure, there are those who will only buy music because its an international brand and has all the marketing shit that goes with it and won't look at the generally more low key affairs which comprise our bands - which possibly do have a pronounced DIY ethic, but probably no more so than a whole bunch of bands from other countries we never get to hear about.
Oh we definitely have international ...
Oh we definitely have international class acts. Of the stuff I've sent to the States the most feedback has been about Goodshirt, Shihad and Fur Patrol. Now someone really needs to make a NZ music complilation, call it Music from the land of Lord of the Rings, Russell Crowe was born here - music born here too, anything, get the music over to other countries. Sure you may say, why do we need to get overseas recognition it is fine where it is but come on doesn't it make you sick inside treasuring all this fine music after a while?
I was thinking to myself the other day what if we had overseas producers doing all our music, if all the bands followed American trends and I realised what is the point?
I'm not sure if I followed you ...
I'm not sure if I followed you correctly....I think we have some pretty good producers and nothing wrong with the equipment either. I do get the feeling though, if bands got a bit more funding, they could spend alot more time in recording studios developing to their hearts content. U2 spends a month on one song apparently. That may be greedy, but most NZ musicians get a few months on a whole album tops. Okay okay, U2 are multimillionaires.
I'm beginning to doubt the benefits of slogging one's arse off in NZ and doing gigs at local pubs. There's so much I'd like to see changed to make this even viable. Part of the problem, I firmly believe, is our population...and the lack thereof is one of the things I kind of like about NZ, but it has to suck for musicians.
well you have to remember that the ...
well you have to remember that the music industry is still growing, still young.
/// Music from the land of Lord of the ...
/// Music from the land of Lord of the Rings but they would think it was celtic,
try the Real Music from the Land of Lord of the Rings
[ external link ]
as long as they buy it I don't mind ...
as long as they buy it I don't mind what they think it is.
but can you just see the faces of the ...
but can you just see the faces of the poor old nana's faces when sitting back to enjoy enya with a nice cupa only to have blindspott start screaming at them?
umm, mwah ha ha ha! then the world! ?...
umm, mwah ha ha ha! then the world! ?
//as long as they buy it I don't mind ...
//as long as they buy it I don't mind what they think it is
i thought the point was to get recognition of new zealand acts?
and stop copying your own posts its a bad look - soooooo last year as well hahaha
// i thought the point was to get ...
// i thought the point was to get recognition of new zealand acts?
once they buy it and listen to it, then the recognition comes into play. Hopefully to the effect of "oh I like that NZ music stuff, give me more."
// and stop copying your own posts its a bad look - soooooo last year as well hahaha
go back to your fresh homemade latte and your one word name magazine with the glossy photos. relax infront of your designer tv with its most talked about shows. polish those nifty shoes with your label slacks and hip shirt from the store with all your money. smile your well practiced mouthline, charm the star sparkling eyes of your peers. dodge the banana peels life throws at you with your hand crafted walking stick. bite me with your well kept dentures of pearly whiteyness, because I need to feel good about myself, do you feel good about yourself?
I hope so, your nose is weird.
[umm, err, dunno what happened here]
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA sorry to ...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
sorry to clog up the message board, but that post deserved a laughing reply
great stuff..... fuck authority and all that hoohaa
Yea, it may be growing, but our ...
Yea, it may be growing, but our population has to grow too. I think I've already said that you only need about ahundred people to have a "sell out" gig here, and that just aint enough to feed the family.
I suppose we expect musicians to suffer for their art though. I kind of think that they should too. That "Sell-out" issue is always an accute debate.
brillant! yes, should music be a full ...
brillant! yes, should music be a full time job or should it remain a pure outlet of expression?
In this context, I think "world class" ...
In this context, I think "world class" would mean having (commericial) success on the world stage. This is yet to happen to any NZ band in the current environment.
I think all NZ music needs is for one band to be successful in a big market - preferably the US or UK - and let the press and their hype angle do the rest.
Has anyone seen a single review/article/whatever about Bjork (or latterly Sigur Ros) that FAILED to mention that they are from Iceland (usually followed by some noun like pixie or fairy or nymph or extremely short person that sometimes shouts quite loudly)?
If one band grew successful enough to be noticed by say, the NME, I believe the resulting hype could direct a lot of attention towards other deserving bands here that really only need a bit of a push to make it big.
extreme good point who had heard of ...
extreme good point who had heard of Irish music, before U2... funny when U2 first got big meet up with some Irish back packers who couldn't believe that we were listening to their band, I have wondered ever since if there are bands out there that are spreading the word in the world arena and we are back at home just taking them for granted without knowing the impact they are having.
all eyes on the datsuns please...
all eyes on the datsuns please
I know its not the kind of coverage a ...
I know its not the kind of coverage a big name might get, but D4 has had a favourable review of Rock and roll motherfucker in NME:
"New Zealand does not have a rich rock 'n roll heritage. There's Crowded House, not renowned for burning down Babylon, and... well that's about it. Enter then Dion and Jimmy, the core of The D4. They play mean garage punk rock with nods towards Motorhead and AC/DC and a pinch of Jon Spencer. They make the sort of joyous, mucky noise that The Hives, try as they might, consistently fail to render. This should be single of the week not just because the title contains all the words you ever really need, but because The D4 have a drummer called Beaver. "
Hmm, I've been losing faith in the ole ...
Hmm, I've been losing faith in the ole hype-o-rific NME over the past while, but that's a pretty good bit of writing. It's true too; let's just hope, with their song nominated as "single of the week", that they'll get the goods in the UK.
Ahhhh the Datsuns. Give me that dirty ...
Ahhhh the Datsuns. Give me that dirty old, down to earth rock any time, day or night. Mmmmm. Touring with The White Stripes????
Not that many eyes have been on them because of their genre, but who knows, even K'Lee may have to lick their leather-clad arses as being responsible for international interest.
i'm not sure anything needs to be ...
i'm not sure anything needs to be changed or worried about. nz music is well regarded overseas - people like Martin Phillipps and HDU are really well thought of on the college circut ... just because they aint pushing units like N'Sync aint no reason to worry. There's a big difference between good marketing and good music.
And should we be worried if nz music aint rocking overseas' kasbahs? Who cares? It's ours and i don't think we need overseas approval to say if its good or not.
"The State" of nz music is good and getting better by the day. in a way i'm relieved that it aint a multi-million $ industry ... coming from Dunedin, that wouldn't suit our sort of aesthetic down here ... poverty and struggling keeps us honest, keeps us hungry and keeps us trying to break through. Good music is rarely recognised - that's not a specifically NZ problem either, if you look at something like the UK's Top of the Pops ...
DON'T WORRY! LISTEN! PLAY! BUY! *ENJOY*!!!!!!!
Bloody Good Points!...
Bloody Good Points!
yeah iluvtheclean very good points I ...
yeah iluvtheclean
very good points
I have said elsewhere before that the history of great music is a history of the outsider and their stuggle to express themselves.
poverty and hardship and tragedy and turmoil are the things that bring out great art in people. Its not isolated to music. Its something that through history and all artforms inspires the best in people. money and fame tends to sidetrack the process of making great art, and its probably more so in popular music.
While the New Zealand music industry, in the last few years, has certainly developed and become smarter and in step with those of other developed countries, I would argue that the music has become very homogenous and far too focused on radio play. Its true that radio is the secret to selling records but I know alot of bands that are writing songs specifically to fit formats, which means sounding like other bands. While this will get you on the radio and get you fans , it does not translate overseas as proven by some our more successful groups.
Hopefully the development of the major industry here will spawn a strong independant industry that can take the really great and unique music here and get it overseas where it'll be appreciated by the wide audience it deserves. Flying Nun were doing it but somewhere it all went very wrong.
If your band has a really international ...
If your band has a really international sound, ie; your manager says "NZ may not get into you, but ? might"... should NZ be flagged completely? The thought of writing a song specifically for NZ air play kills me.
no. NZ should definately not be ...
no. NZ should definately not be flagged, as you call it. but simply due to the population there is more than likely going to be a greater number of people in larger cities and countries that will be sympathetic to your music.
I'm slightly confused by the 'international sound' comment. If that means that you sound like creed or garbage or bush then I beleive that you can really only concentrate on cracking NZ because is likely that there are a gazillion other bands in the states or the UK that sound exactly the same and why would anyone be interested in a band from NZ.
That was the wrong term. God help the ...
That was the wrong term. God help the band with the international sound of a Hallmark parcel being unwrapped. What I mean is "a band that will do better else where" because there's just not enough audience for diversity here. I mean, how many people really took notice of the D4? No doubt they'll come here on the tail-end of international fame and we'll finally claim them as our own, whether they want to be affiliated with us or not.
As a side note. We need a new country for stars to call home after being unwitting ropes in the tug-of-war between Australia and NZ. How bout it Lemonde...let's design a flag over a slice of pavlova.
Last night I went to two gigs, and as I ...
Last night I went to two gigs, and as I drove home I was thinking about this idea of "improving" New Zealand music. One of the gigs I went to was a big international event, with a $71 ticket price, flash imanges on the screen, onstage gimmicks and several thousand people in attendance. The other had no onstage gimmicks (unless you count "our drummer is going to Canada, we love him and want to hug him" is a gimmick. It had no video footage, a $7 price tag and probably less than 200 in attendance, all of whom were at eye to eye level with the bands.
I don't know how it was for the musicians, but I got far more out of the experience of being at the Royal Rumble/Offbeats gig than going to see Tool - there was more immediacy and innovation in the music, there was a more direct relationship between the bands and their audience, there was less feeling of them doing a job - in essence, it was just so much more fun and personal at the low key gig, it had soul.
I think that to make it big, a huge amount is lost. Sure, there are the compensations of money, fame, world class travel and better groupies but I don't know if I'd want all that if it was to turn music making into a marketing exercise and a job. And the guys from Tool might talk about how they're not into marketing all they want, they're just as involved in that process - with their merchandise, videos, free ticket giveaways, stage performances, calculated mystique.
There have been bands who have engaged in the struggle iluvtheclean mentions, achieved the break through but then simply stopped, because the vitality in their music arose as part of that struggle. They were the sensible ones. Others have not known what the fuck to do once they have achieved a break through, muddled along trying various things and generally making a mess of things. Then there are those who hit a particular formula and stick with it, because they have created a market for it.
you are so right about the // there was ...
you are so right about the // there was more immediacy, and intimacy as I read your post I was thinking about the gigs I have been to over the last year and by far the best ones where in smallish venues.
The goodshirt one was in a wee restaurant.... the useable area no bigger than our sitting room and that's what it felt like, with the stage only about 20cm higher than the floor and that's what it felt like having band in my own space not like gods up on high, I love how even well named / known Nz bands more often than not mingle have a few beers, share in the atmosphere of the gig.... this is one of the things that is great in the state
are there such things as talent scouts ...
are there such things as talent scouts in the nz music industry?
do they only go to gigs in auckland?
is that why all the bands signed to major labels are from that city?
hmmmm?
whoops i forgot anika and zed - silly ...
whoops i forgot anika and zed - silly me.
I was just going to ask about ChCH...
I was just going to ask about ChCH
But is it possible that with Flying ...
But is it possible that with Flying Nuns move to the big A that the sounds from the deep south are not being as well recognised???
and the feelers and stellar and weta ...
and the feelers and stellar
and weta and breathe
and ...............
most of them are not from Auckland
dunedin has long been forgotten by ...
dunedin has long been forgotten by flying nun except for the old stable
all recent signings seem to be from ...
all recent signings seem to be from auckland. stellar is an auckland band as far as i'm concerned. weta and breathe were over before they really got started.
Included in 'outside' Auckland bands ...
Included in 'outside' Auckland bands - Salmonella Dub, Fur Patrol, and of course Shihad/Pacifier.
What Auckland bands??? I can only think of about 3 or 4 that are 'fully' signed to the 'major' labels, e.g. Blindspott, ElomenoP, Dimmer, Che Fu.
Bands like Tadpole, Goodshirt, Pluto, Augustino, Sommerset etc... are marketed and distributed by majors (Tadpole/Goodshirt/Pluto - EMI; Augustino - Sony; Sommerset - BMG), but are under their own labels or are hooked up with inde labels (e.g Tadpole/Pluto - Antenna; Goodshirt/Augustino - band owned; Sommerset - Shock).
You've got ya Betchadupas and Rubicons, but you've also got your HDUs and Slims.
I reckon you've got a pretty good contingent form all the country!
Pardon my 'England' - i meant: 'a ...
Pardon my 'England' - i meant: 'a pretty good contingent from all over the country!'
I think the Wellington contingent is ...
I think the Wellington contingent is slightly lacking.
Why? Surely you're not implying that ...
Why? Surely you're not implying that it's Auckland's fault???
yea - i'd have to agree with that one ...
yea - i'd have to agree with that one *cough*
[ http://www.canvas.net.nz ]
woopsa daisy - talking about welly ...
woopsa daisy - talking about welly contingent there...*crack*
yeah, it's all Auckland's fault, heck ...
yeah, it's all Auckland's fault, heck you guys voted for John Banks didn't cha?
ha ha ha, suckers.
Seriously, I don't know whose fault it is or if there is anyone to blame, it just is what it is.
Wellington had a good run of some of ...
Wellington had a good run of some of the most prominent bands around for a while - Shihad, HLAH, Weta, Fur Patrol, King Kapisi. Sometimes it's Christchurch, Dunedin or Auckland etc... Different scenes - different sounds.
i would have thought it was climatic. ...
i would have thought it was climatic.
naturally auckland would dominate the decent band percentage in having higher populace.
for me, i'm waiting on the neo dunedin/capital comeback.