What does it mean when someone says a band or artist is "packaged"?
People would say that the likes of Britney, N'Sync, etc are "packaged", but an example isn't a definition. What does it really mean?
What does it mean when someone says a band or artist is "packaged"?
People would say that the likes of Britney, N'Sync, etc are "packaged", but an example isn't a definition. What does it really mean?
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well the way I see it is that it is ...
well the way I see it is that it is leaning towards mass production as Soldier Boy said but from the get go, everything has been planned before the band is started, a concept is the starting point which is then exploited for commercial gain.
Sounds like a good definition, Stefan. ...
Sounds like a good definition, Stefan. So the likes of Mandy Moore, Bardot, Kiss and the Sex Pistols would be good examples.
It's more about the image than the actual content (except where the content is a vital part of the image in the case of the Pistols).
Shit, it doesn't even have to be a new artist or band. Aerosmith are the classic "bad boy rockers now clean" pumping out those radio-friendly hits. And Madonna changes her image with every new album.
So, my next question...is packaging a bad thing?
no.... packaging becomes ...
no.... packaging becomes prepackaging
the label/logo/buy-line on the package becomes the signifier / the false idol
like the campbells soup can is nostalgia elevated to art (pop = nostalgia over canned goods)
stronger emotions like pride / passion / empathy / survival are all drying up like our appendix because the questions have all been answered by capitalism... spiritually we're bankrupt - it's too easy... ennui / boredom / apathy / blandness ad infinitum...
tragedy comes to us in between sports results and the weather and is as thought provoking as situation comedy or big brother
there has to be a movement back to the listener
how can we feel the urgency of our own destiny - and feel vital in this world...
we're so passive - dazed under merchandising and fashion and the power of our disposable incomes to play along with all that shit
and this idea that you can make a career off catchy music... plllllllease
what motivates the people who muy all ...
what motivates the people who muy all the shit music? peer pressure and trying to be cool and trend and hype and colorful music videos full of booty and shmulz
lets all stop buying music / boycot emi sony universal etc
and watch them twist and turn under new marketting strategies to give us what we want - when we've realised we don't want what they're force-feeding us under the guise of pop - *cough* michael jackson *cough*
//what motivates the people who muy all ...
//what motivates the people who muy all the shit music? peer pressure and trying to be cool and trend and hype and colorful music videos full of booty and shmulz
you mean, what motivates people to buy music that YOU think is shit. i know what you're trying to say mate, but attempting to group all buyers of 'shit' music into the materialistic 5 minute attention span infidels slot is wrong. you are claiming that music shouldn't be consumed when it doesn't agree with your ideals.
the fact that you have a cynical perspective towards life in general doesn't make me want to give up all hope - yet this is your 'package' that you are projecting; it's you. assuming that people only buy certain kinds of music because of capitalistic advertising = a statement that all people who buy chart-toppers have no mind of their own and have what they like decided by companies - that i definitely resent.
//we're so passive
i am so content. i do not worry myself with spiritual equality matters in music. i do not worry. this doesn't mean i am a fat cat capitalist lying back and not being a spiritual entity in myself. i can still find ultimate happiness and contentment on a beach somewhere with someone close to me; i am happy without this boycot of labels to make them 'give us what we want'.
have you ever noticed the amounts of bands on major labels that fail? or the hundreds or thousands that you have never even heard of because they haven't made it out of their homeland - despite major label support? this is because WE didn't buy their stuff. WE is humanity, and we choose not to support these bands...... when has a label forced you to listen to their music? when have they all connived in the back room and decided there will be only one style of music, pop, and made your tv's channel's unchangeable?
YOU have the choice.
I have the choice.
we all have the choice - i am using it, and so are you...... but sometimes we need to be more embracing of humanity, not complaining because someone else seems to be sucking the soul out of it - OUR mindset is the only way that this spiritual rape will become reality, but if we realise our ultimate choice power then we are safe.
au revoir monsieur
// i am happy without this boycot of ...
// i am happy without this boycot of labels to make them 'give us what we want'.
There will always be a "mainstream", there will always be people that will complain about the mainstream. If what they like becomes mainstream then that has effectively "sold out" regardless and they find something else, rinse and repeat.
I would love to find the upper limit of ...
I would love to find the upper limit of people who can like band before they have "sold out". Also is it possible to get back in once you've sold out?
all this shit music isn't embracing ...
all this shit music isn't embracing humanity
it's perpetuating inanity
I am deep down a humanist and irrepressible optimist
despite the stomach churning sensation I get when I switch on a tv or radio
i guess i believe in a myth where music was language before we divvied it up into words and semantics and pedantics... and got all anal and unrhythmical and square
and i think everybody has that pure music in them - so why do we flock like moths to all this marketting moguls thinly veiled pop/shmulz?
when we could all be making our own music - and drumming all night round the fire and making love in the jungle till the break of day
jimi's is right... dissing something ...
jimi's is right... dissing something only brings out the belligerent defenderers
so I'll offer up an alternative instead... for myself... I'll make my own beautiful original music and lull myself back to loving mankind :) sweetness and light
I hope that all the unheard music which ...
I hope that all the unheard music which is /failing/ is only failing economically - but is still enriching the people who make it - because they are making music THEY love...
so what if there's no career in your music... (most likely scenario of original music)
we make music to hear our own voice resonanting up - maybe? and it's good therapy
//what motivates ppl to buy all this ...
//what motivates ppl to buy all this shit music, peer pressure and trying to be cool and trendy...
Most of the ppl who buy this music you call 'packaged' Britney etc are either young and dont give a rats ass - and like what they hear, The older ppl who like it, I doubt very much that it has anything to do with trying to be cool - and peer pressure is telling them the opposite - if you like Britney or N'sync your a geek with no taste, you cant be cool AND like that music, (I have witnessed it in these forums) I Like Britney! but that dosn't make me a folllower - in fact I think it makes me the opposite, If I was a follower I would agree with everyone else my age and say that I think she's crap - but I dont.
I personally think that if she released a song you didn't hate, none of you would admit it for fear of being ridiculed.
depends all on ur opinion! (doesn't ...
depends all on ur opinion! (doesn't everything?) but yeah a band that has the whole gig (actually show) PLANNED e.g. joke, song, comment u use every concert.
they're aimed specificly at 1 age group/gender & often have their lyrics written 4 them
thats what i think of as packaged
Wow. I've created a monster....
Wow. I've created a monster.
u me both...
u me both
the old frankenstein syndrome we ...
the old frankenstein syndrome
we create an artificial life because we think we can improve nature...
so stop listernig to music and return ...
so stop listernig to music and return to the real sounds of the jungle, birds wind thunder rain water over rocks -- the music of the natural world
I'd say packaged when applied to a ...
I'd say packaged when applied to a band means the same thing as applied to any product. It means focus was put on the method of presentation, design, and appearance as opposed to the actual product or content the package will contain. The content is secondary, or even the last part of the process, and not as important as how it is presented. The person doing the packaging assumes that no matter the content, it will sell, based on successful packaging, whether that be bubble gum or bubble gum pop. Basically the reverse of the creative process: person->writes songs->becomes an icon for something, whereas packaging is think of an icon->write songs->find person
Hmm, I agree in part - but I don't ...
Hmm, I agree in part - but I don't think packaging and manufacturing are necessarily the same thing. For instance - the Beatles. The early Beatles weren't manufactured, they all met eachother while kids and wrote their own songs. Enter Brain Epstein - he gets the guys to start wearing poncy Italian suits instead of leathers (thus giving them a friendlier look and upsetting the wild child John Lennon) and convinces them to ditch Pete Best and recruit Ringo Starr because he fit the image (and was a better drummer). See, packaging could also be taking something that already exists and polishing it up for mass consumption.
//See, packaging could also be taking ...
//See, packaging could also be taking something that already exists and polishing it up for mass consumption.
Absolutely. That's why I asked if being a packaged act is a bad thing. I should have asked if it's *necesarily* a bad thing...
[ external link ]
good point and agreed soldier boy. I ...
good point and agreed soldier boy. I think it is just a matter of degree. You can either you take a rough band and polish them up, or start from scratch and find some people to fill the poncy Italian suits, or better yet you don't bother with the actual people. eg. "Sugar, sugar' - The Archies. Apologies, if that song gets stuck in your head.
sorry 'SoldierBoy', I just realized I ...
sorry 'SoldierBoy', I just realized I placed a space there in my last post.
// I should have asked if it's ...
// I should have asked if it's *necesarily* a bad thing...
If the music is good, who cares? I think the hardest thing for people to get past is the image and peer pressure. Music snobbery, someone should really do a study.
like studying why they make chewing ...
like studying why they make chewing lose it's flavour so quick these days....
it's all related somehow... hmmmm
and cigarettes burn so fast ... hmmm ...
and cigarettes burn so fast ... hmmm another "coincidence"
no, not really. I was thinking ...
no, not really.
I was thinking academic.
Musical snobbery has a lot to answer ...
Musical snobbery
has a lot to answer for, I COULD tell you a story about a young local band (ie same town as me) that come out in the mid to late 80s when my freinds who were Mature that we that on hearing them play made the following comment round our table
"oh good lord, what are they tring to do?
Heavy Metal that was so last year.
pour me another of that new one from Martinbough wont you darling
And as for that skinny one with the big nose, he can't even sing, and why on earth would he name himself after that lovely old chap from its in the bag?"
But I won't because I am just not brave enough
packaging music is like showing the ...
packaging music is like showing the cover and not the book.
When intention is there, it does not matter what the vehicle is,
an idea is transmitted and as someone stated above WE catch
the reflection within ourselves.
Here in the states a billboard reads "music is 85% in the imagination of the listener." It would seem we hear INTO something with our own inner music. If what we hear is in resonance with our own feeling, emotions and intuitions then we lock on so to speak with a like frequency. The ideal use of packaging would be merely as
station on the dial to get us where we want to go...
The use of packaging BEFORE a concept is not bad either really.
Nature packages her flowers with scent and brilliant hues so as
to attract. Why not music too if the core is accurate in relation
to the shell?
Hence, packaging in it's ideal and un adulterated form would be
merely as a librarian showing an interested reader to the section of library they are seeking. Thus, the mere idea of packaging is NOT bad, it just IS.
With that said, NZ music is amazing. Miles and
miles of respect to the artists I've seen on this site, and to the
site as well!
The polynesian influence is killer along with what I am sensing
is some type of tribal influence ala Trinity Roots? Trust me, you
guys don't really have an issue with over packaging in NZ. USA,
thats another story altogeather!
Cheers
that a wicked observation jamerj. ...
that a wicked observation jamerj. thankyou. are you from the USA? how did you find about NZ music scene? is it well known there?
Aaaaahhh , very well said JamerJ !!!!...
Aaaaahhh , very well said JamerJ !!!!
Ed writes: "I hope that all the ...
Ed writes: "I hope that all the unheard music which is /failing/ is only failing economically - but is still enriching the people who make it - because they are making music THEY love..."
[Applause] Is the song of the Kingfisher (bird) a failure
because only two or three others hear it? Failure is
highly relative. If you got a rise out of it is it really
a failure across the board?
..."so what if there's no career in your music... (most likely scenario of original music) we make music to hear our own voice resonanting up - maybe? and it's good therapy."
With that attitude and an instrument how could you ultimately fail?
If anyone can stick to that grounding rod you just gave they WILL
have their time. F A I T H I S T H E K E Y
Making music and having a self image of success are TWO different
things. There are folks making original music and very successful.
There are folks making original music and unsuccessful.
There folks making relatively unoriginal music and very successful.
There are folks making relatively unoriginal music and very
unsuccessful...
The strange thing is that success seems to originate as an idea
within us, and if held steady as a feeling, it eventually seems to
happen in our world. So play whatever tune you want but just
keep in the zone of feeling success.
The great challange: How would you talk think and act if you
had what it is you really want? If you could live in that vibration
at the exclusion of other ideas for a length of time it maybe that
it would manifest?
Can you hear you own head voices telling how you shouldn't
be successful? Can you hear your own resistance to the idea?
That would be friction of the principle. It maybe easy to hold the idea for ten or fifteen minutes. But hold it for weeks, and
you'll see the other ideas in your own mind fighting to keep
the status quo.
This is called imaging. One would image success and hold the idea
like a magnifying glass in the sun over a leaf until the smoke appears. Stay clear and don't use anyone else's measure of success, especially with regard to the commercial aspects of music. Get the idea that
original music WILL have a market (and it does-checkout MassEnsemble.com) and let the idea that conformity equals success die by lack of attention to that idea.
Furthermore, our wishing other's to have success and contributing toward that in any way we can, has amazing relatations to our own success.
Use it
bravo. although i feel the kind of ...
bravo.
although i feel the kind of people that agree with you, will not think thru this statement: 'our wishing other's to have success and contributing toward that in any way we can, has amazing relatations to our own success.'
like you seem to be saying, people will have different opinions of what failure is. so, understandably, some will view success as being the next britney. why shouldn't some of us define sales and money as forms of success? people need to remove some of their bias and judge the music FOR the music.
to quote stefan higher up: "There will always be a "mainstream", there will always be people that will complain about the mainstream. If what they like becomes mainstream then that has effectively "sold out" regardless and they find something else, rinse and repeat."
why does this have to be the case????
sorry, I'm going to butt in ...
sorry, I'm going to butt in here.
// why does this have to be the case????
Because it goes beyond music and money to image and who you are. Some people abhor the people that like "mainstream" music and thus will do their best to differentiate themselves from them. So as soon as a band they like is accepted by these people the differentiation is lost, admitting to liking that band is admitting you are just another punter.
ah sorry didn't know you'd ...
ah sorry didn't know you'd replied.
what i was saying:
'why does this have to be the case????'
equals
'i hate it how this happens. i know there's nothing i can do about it, and i know this has been said a million times before, but i wish we could be a bit more understanding of people sometimes. also musical snobbery sucks.'
sweet mate
ahh gotcha, I guess I can blame the ...
ahh gotcha, I guess I can blame the internet and it's inadequate, at times, forms of communication or just my muddled old mind.
"...that a wicked observation jamerj. ...
"...that a wicked observation jamerj. thankyou. are you from the USA?"
Yes. New York city area...
" how did you find about NZ music scene?"
Search engine via Yahoo typing New Zealand + Music.
" is it well known there? "
I couldn't accurately answer that question for 260 million people. I can say that of the folks I told about the site, none had heard about it before. However ALL have commented on how well its designed in terms pf artist reference and access to not only audio but video streaming. I DO know of some associates who are heavily into the NZ music scene becuase there is, on the whole, far less edge here in the states. One could say we are relentlessly spanked with Brittney. Not that she's bad, but that there's more potential now with converging world cultures that new combinations are possible. Some elements of the NZ scene as represented on this site confirm this in flying colors.
"nibbles"
I reckon a clone of everything else. ...
I reckon a clone of everything else. Not intentionally original.