For a while I've been building valve guitar amps in my workshop for my own pleasure, and also listening to a cool style develop in kiwi music. Lots of feedback, extended chords with extra notes, and all this barely contained melody.
This kind of stuff is hard to coax out of amps at the kind of volumes you're all constrained to playing at. I'm Welly based, and I don't know how many times I've heard Greg asking the guitarists to turen their amps down, only to hear the common refrain 'but it only sounds good this loud!'
Well, I've scrounged up a bit of backing from the wonderful folk at Guitar Gallery and we're going into production. We're going to build a guitar amp, all valve, hand wired, no PCBs, around $1500 for a combo. The idea is to make a highly responsive amp that feeds back very controllably, with clarity when overdriven even when you're playing mad chords with discordant notes, at a comfy volume for 50-150 capacity venues. I also want to make them beer proof.
As information-savvy musicians of New Zealand, we'd like your feedback; what features do you actually use on your amp? I want to make sure it's going to suit a lot of us, not just me.
Do you typically use one, two, or three sounds in a song?
Do you change your EQ settings during your set for individual songs?
Do you use both humbuckers and single coils during a set?
Do you like amps with the controls on the top or the front?
Your opinion will be much valued! If you have anything you particularly like about an amp you've played or heard, I'd love to hear about it also.
Cheers,
--
Darren
Lucid Tone
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You didn't happen to build Mark from ...
You didn't happen to build Mark from Ghostplane's amp did you?
I had a go on that and it was the best sounding thing evs. One volume knob.
Agreed: My dream amp has one knob for ...
Agreed: My dream amp has one knob for volume/gain, and that's it. It has to be a cool looking knob though... like the F.A.C. knob on Orange amps... ;-)
BTW I was playing through an Orange head this week which had a clever 'On' switch- solid three position type, 'On' 'Standby' & 'Off'- no seperate switch for standby. Very economical.
Loud enough for gigging? 25 - 30 watts into an 8 ohm load?
Speaker type: Maybe pop a Celestion G12H 30 in there? 30 watts power handling, 100db sensitivity- nice, 'loud' speaker with good tone. ???
Hope you sell loads- great concept!
Hey tclak, yes I built Mark's amp, ...
Hey tclak, yes I built Mark's amp, glad you liked it! A lot of love and time tweaking it exactly right. :-) It will actually be the basis of the final product; probably with a bit more gain tho for anyone who likes it metal. /m/
Foetusboy, the plan was 18 watts and use a very efficient speaker - the G12H is certainly a frontrunner there! A pair of 6V6 output tubes actually, big bottle EL84s with more bottom end.
My personal amp has one gain knob and that's it. I don't really believe in having EQ knobs; YMMV tho and it's your mileage after all!
Re: speaker, once we have a prototype cab built I'll get several front baffles made up so we can swap various speakers in and out easily. I have a Jensen alnico P12R and a 60's Celestion Silver Bell but will def. try and find a G12H to try out! :-)
I recently did a ton of research on ...
I recently did a ton of research on replacement speakers for my old Ampeg, and value-for-money wise, I couldn't go past Celestion. I'm currently using a reissue G12M greenback- not as gutsy as a G12H, & if I could've found a similar deal I wouldv'e gone for one instead, but I'm more than happy with the sound of the G12M, very warm and dynamic, great rock/blues speaker, and actually a damn good match for the Ampeg.
BTW Those are some nice speakers you're testing your amp with!
//Hey tclak, yes I built Mark's amp, ...
//Hey tclak, yes I built Mark's amp, glad you liked it!
It was the sweetest sounding thing I've ever played through. I liked the early "combo" version (as I prefer combos) but - the sound! One fucking volume knob!
What are the specs for that one?
How do I get one just like it?
Dude, you're genius!
//Dude, you're genius! I've been ...
//Dude, you're genius!
I've been saying that about him for years!
But the amps are sweet - when we were recording with The Dukes of Leisure we had the chance to play an old VOX AC30 - plugged in Cookie Monster (his blue fuzzy monstrosity of an amp) next to it and I think I actually prefered Cookie Monster!
Plus the lucidtone guitar pedals are great too - Paddy is the best tremelo I have ever played.
Do you have a website or something? ...
Do you have a website or something? I'm very interested to find out about how this all develops . . .
There is a website but it's currently ...
There is a website but it's currently down until the registration fee is sorted out again :-/
[ http://lucidtone.com ]
Oh just a note - I'm not actually ...
Oh just a note - I'm not actually involved in lucidtone - just play with Darren in a couple of bands and swear by the gear he makes...
There is nothing I'd like to see more in this world than Lucidtone take off as a brand!
Cheers Scott :-) And tclak ...
Cheers Scott :-)
And tclak :-)
It makes me happy.
////Dude, you're genius! I've been ...
////Dude, you're genius! I've been saying that about him for years!
I became convinced when he made my Orange sound better, and my Big Muff sound HEAPS better, and when he built 3 light activated theremins into a single strat body along with all the usual hardware, and, and, and... etc etc..
A genius. And a clean cut and respectable looking one now, too. (The blue mullet live on in our hearts, though :)
That strat is a work of art :-D I am ...
That strat is a work of art :-D I am so putting theremins in my telecaster.
1 no both front with handles on ...
1
no
both
front
with handles
on side
so you can
stack them
Me too :-) I'm glad I'm not the only ...
Me too :-) I'm glad I'm not the only one!
Handles on side is an interesting one. I've found they're usually put a bit too low so that your forearms have to curl round the edges and it's a bit awkward. I'll make sure it's very comfy to carry aye.
detachable casters...
detachable casters
Hi Darren, I have owned a few amps ...
Hi Darren,
I have owned a few amps in my time. I'm going to write the stuff I like and maybe you'll put some of it into your amp. Of course everyone is different - if I could have a combo custom built for me this is what I would ask for. This is essentially a three channel amp - A clean channel, a "cranked clean amp" channel, and an overdrive channel.
2 x 12" Celestion Vintage 30s
2 channels - one clean/dirty(can be switched between), one overdrive. Clean part of clean channel is totally Fender clean but with gain control begins to break up if gain goes past about 12 oclock, dirty is a even more break up sound ala a cranked Fender Twin and beyond. Clean setting and dirty setting have seperate gains - allowing for crystal clean and a cranked clean amp (or Fender) sound, but share their EQ.
Channel two would be more of a standard rock setting, a marshall style channel.
Controls for each channel :
Channel One:
Clean Gain, Dirty Gain, Treble, Mid, Bass (-/+ for each, with a notch at 12 o'clock for flat eq settings) and Channel Volume.
Channel Two:
Gain, Treble, Mid, Bass (-/+ for each, with a notch at 12 o'clock for flat eq settings) and Channel Volume.
Spring Reverb (one master control)
Master Volume
Some sort of function for adjusting the wattage of the amp, so you could run it at 60watts, 30watts and 15watts. This would be fantastic. No more ringing ears during bedroom practice.
Two button footswitch - channel one clean or dirty, and channel two.
This would be pretty much my perfect guitar amp - a Fender clean sound that could instantly switch to Fender cranked sound without a change in volume, and then a marshall style overdrive channel for really rocking out. Shit, I would happily pay $1500 for an amp like that, especially a locally made one that I knew was not going to be mass-produced. I'd probably buy two of em. Even if this could be custom built at greater expense I'd still be very keen.
I love amplifiers even more than I love guitars - I've just spent twenty minutes thinking about what I would want in my dream combo.
I know nothing of electronics and I've probably asked for the impossible, or at least not financially viable, but even if it gives you some ideas for your amp, that's cool. I'll be watching this thread. Good luck with the venture.
Oh, and one other thing. Those metal ...
Oh, and one other thing. Those metal legs that Fender put on their amps - brilliant! I love being able to lean my Twin back without having to get a chair for it or something. Just a little extra something that makes all the difference.
And knobs on the front, not the top.
> Fender clean sound that could ...
> Fender clean sound that could instantly switch to Fender cranked sound without a change in volume
That's a really good point. Fender cranked tone comes from the power tubes; i reckon you can actually do that with the current design as long as your clean gain is set right before it distorts. You could use a booster type pedal to get into power tube distortion from there no problem, and with no volume difference. That's the beauty of 15-20W valve amps, they're at perfact gig volume in kiwi venues anyway.
> a marshall style overdrive channel for really rocking out
Hopefully people like the overdrive from these amps as much as a Marshall! tclak, if you're reading, what kind of sound would you say Mark's amp got when you pushed it, as the design I want to put into production is quite similar?
> Two button footswitch - channel one clean or dirty, and channel two.
I was intending on supplying a one button switch with blue LED, isn't it so annoying when an amp doesn't come with one!!!
thanks for your well thought out ideas!
Oh, the cab design will negate the need for angling your amp back, too ;-)
//tclak, if you're reading, what kind ...
//tclak, if you're reading, what kind of sound would you say Mark's amp got when you pushed it, as the design I want to put into production is quite similar?
I didn't push it too hard. It was a really chiming, clear sound that reacted beautifully to the hotcake. Lots of tops and mids. Probably the least complex sound I've heard from any amp, and I loved it! It sounded like an amp, not a fucking rack-EQ-inside-an-amp (which are suitable for those who wanna play "modern rock" ala Creed).
I reckon less is more for a good amp. Three channel shmee channel. What for? Let a fuzz box take care of the distortion. They do it best.
How would I go about getting one? Email addy? Mark's amp is honestly my dream amp!
//(which are suitable for those who ...
//(which are suitable for those who wanna play "modern rock" ala Creed).
Do Creedesque rockers need to buy specially hard amps and monitors to support their feet?
(sorry, i'll let you get back to the serious discussion now)
tclak - you can contact me at ...
tclak - you can contact me at b@wadda.org. just working on getting lucidtone.com back up.
:-)
Email sent. You little ANZAC....
Email sent. You little ANZAC.
Oh, and . . . //Do Creedesque ...
Oh, and . . .
//Do Creedesque rockers need to buy specially hard amps and monitors to support their feet?
No. They are suspended about 6" from the ground, thanks to Jesus' love. They don't hurt anything, except the ears and minds of far too many people who have bad taste in music.
[ http://www.yhbtm.com ]
maybe building one with wheels....
maybe building one with wheels.
Do you typically use one, two, or three ...
Do you typically use one, two, or three sounds in a song? 2
Do you change your EQ settings during your set for individual songs? No
Do you use both humbuckers and single coils during a set? Single only
Do you like amps with the controls on the top or the front? either - small amp on the ground, it's easier to reach for the top
Great idear - i want one !!
the simplier the better! i like the three stage single swith idear + i cool knob volume / gain and thats it!
18watts may be to much if my AC15 is anything to go by...
I would run something like this in tandem with my vox thru a stereo pedal..
so maybe two inputs would be good high and low
cher
Actually the output tubes I want to use ...
Actually the output tubes I want to use are rated at 14W but torturing them pushes it up near 18. Just ever so slightly quieter than your AC-15.
Wattage is actually an urban myth, as your experience probably shows! Your AC-15 would leave an 80W marshall valvestate for dead, right? :-P
Re: inputs, I want to keep it as simple as possible; clearer sound, less to break down, and of course cheaper that way. So I was going to have two inputs, one for single coils and one for humbuckers. What do you reckon?
sounds perfect...
sounds perfect
One for single coils, one for humbukers ...
One for single coils, one for humbukers - brilliant idea. Is that why some amps have a low input and a high input? I never knew. Always just plugged into the high input........
Will you do one amp model, or a few? Looks like there's plenty of demand for high quality kiwi made tube amps.....
// Is that why some amps have a low ...
// Is that why some amps have a low input and a high input? //
Actually no, most amps have a low and a high input as they present a different signal to the first preamp stage's input. The high will generally pass a brighter, more responsive signal and the low one (nobody uses it!) has a duller response. Peavey Classic amps go the other way and have a responsive, good soungin input (Normal) and an overly bright, sterile souding input.
Different pickups do respond better to different types of amp, I think this is partially to do with the first preamp stage. So I have designed one input for Telecaster and one for Les Paul.
I want to do one model, and then later add a bass amp. I'm building the first prototype bass amp at home right now actually, based on the mighty Ampeg SVT and Marshall Major amps.
The idea below about adding tremolo and reverb as options later on I think is a good one tho.
// I'm building the first prototype ...
// I'm building the first prototype bass amp at home right now actually
i'm intrigued. please let me know how you get on with this.
i'm in need of some "gark".
I will. It should be finished on the ...
I will. It should be finished on the weekend. It's for Moose from No San Pedro, to match his Ampeg B-15 chassis; he wanted 'grrrr' rather than 'gark' tho :-D
Nato - if you're reading. The bass ...
Nato - if you're reading. The bass amp (Lucid Tone Diesel Moose mkI) is fully operational, and ready to test on Alderaan. It'd be good to get some feedback from some local bass players, and try it out with a few different cabinets to see how it fares if you're interested in a test run? i don't have a bass or a cabinet that will handle it. it's 70W so shouldn't be a problem with most bass cabs tho.
i don't know how 'the sound of your bass even when distorted' is going to sound with active basses , cabs with horns and other non-guitar-type bass oddities... :-/
lemme know.
hey i got some cabinets. would like to ...
hey i got some cabinets. would like to try it on a 4x10 ampeg. and i got an active, 5 string bass. please don't hold that against me.
paselode.at.hotmail.dot.com
sweet, email sent. :-)...
sweet, email sent.
:-)
Heya man, this is really exciting and ...
Heya man, this is really exciting and refreshing to read.
Do you have anything to do with MW amplifiers? They are brilliant.
A couple of ideas anyway.
Perhaps (i don't know how) but give some kinda of stereo compatability. I've got a fetish for stereo delays, and buying two amps to run it well isn't really a nice option. Perhaps bi-amping it, with 2 speaker outs.
How clean would the clean be? 3 stages of gain would be nice. none, some and UBER.
Perhaps built in tremelo too. Yeah, pedals are an option, but the more that can be fitted into such amps the better. And hell, you'd be adding a unique sound to an amplifier and the bands that use it.
But yes, sounds wicked I can't wait to see this get underway.
PS: Cover them in white vinyl or leopard skin. Please? ;)
> MW amplifiers? No, I've seen one ...
> MW amplifiers?
No, I've seen one but never played one. Mal reckoned the one I saw was a clone of a Marshall tho, so probably similar to the SATAN MARSHALL that I built for Brenny from Blue Set. That is the loudest amp I've ever played bar none! 100W Marshall Plexi Lead model, using all original transformers. Delicious, but ridiculous volume for Welly :-P I played it once at Valve and Mark Hamill made me borrow another amp cos it drowned out the PA!!!! *laughs*
Sorry man, but stereo means two power amps which means twice as expensive; ya may as well get two amps. :-(
Re: effects; valve tremolo can sound godlike, but it is another thing to break down; I'd recommend a Lucid Tone Paddy tremolo pedal!
Mark Hamill from Star Wars? Skywalker ...
Mark Hamill from Star Wars? Skywalker was at Valve? Cool.
//Mark Hamill from Star Wars? Skywalker ...
//Mark Hamill from Star Wars? Skywalker was at Valve? Cool.
Yes, and he crossed over to the dark side with Demoniac
and it took the french to recognise ...
and it took the french to recognise their beauty
cover in cherry vinyl... like cherry ...
cover in cherry vinyl... like cherry doc's
The most recent lucidtone prototypes ...
The most recent lucidtone prototypes have been covered with blue fluffy fur (not very beer friendly but looks cool - esepcially when you add a couple of eyes on the amp)...
A customer is doing me a contra at the ...
A customer is doing me a contra at the moment, he's a marketing executive with plenty of cash - he did the worldwide marketing for Volkswagen. Rich bugger. Likes the Stones. He's designing me a few look-and-feel options for the amp.
Fur is *not* going to be the final finish sorry Scott!! I love Cookie Monster and Grover, but they're my pets and production amps will be beer-proof ;-)
I suspect either Tolex (bulletproof vinyl) or just stained wood will be the eventual finish.
Yeah I figured fur was out - but it was ...
Yeah I figured fur was out - but it was damn cool!
You into building guitars too? The ...
You into building guitars too?
The whole amp setup sounds sweet, the switch and one knob setup is genius, may I suggest some nice reverb (may sound stupid since I don't know how it works, but some amps just make it sound so tinny) and any idea roughly ballparkish what they'll be retailing for when you go ahead with the final product?
theremins are sweet..where can i pick up a decent one from?
// You into building guitars too? ...
// You into building guitars too? //
I can heartily recommend Weta Guitars for building excellent quality instruments to order for not much, and Guitar Gallery for setting them up to actually play nice - also for not much.
// nice reverb //
reverb is an odd one. Since a lot of the great sounding distortion happens in the power amp, and reverb gets added in the preamp section, it may not sound the way you'd expect with these amps. Just imagine putting a digital reverb pedal BEFORE a distortion pedal! (personally i love that sound, but it's by no means a normal reverb tone.)
it could be done. it could be done very successfully too. maybe once we've gotten the basic model into production, we could offer upgrades for tremolo and reverb. leaving some space in the chassis and on the front panel dedicated for those purposes would be a good idea.
keep your ideas coming :-)
So where can i get hold of these weta ...
So where can i get hold of these weta guitar people?
and you made no mention of ballpark price?
Weta Guitars, 04-475-3610 Hopefully ...
Weta Guitars, 04-475-3610
Hopefully the combo amp should be around $1500. :-)
oh, and theremins, they are great built ...
oh, and theremins, they are great built into guitars. I'll try and acquire some pics and sound samples of the last one I did, it's awesome and has two light controlled theremins and a light controlled filter in a stratocaster. heaps of fun with strobes or a cellphone torch and waving your hands around your guitar :-D
do you ever expect to have a midi ...
do you ever expect to have a midi controllable rack version?
i really don't know how to take ...
i really don't know how to take that!!
with automatic bum note corrector? :-D